The same-sex marriage debacle continues

So many bad arguments are being put forward to the select committee looking into Louisa Wall's same-sex marriage bill.

One of the first couples in New Zealand to have a civil union say that was a compromise and only being able to marry would give them equality.

I'm sorry to have to inform these two men that in order to gain full equality, in the way that they define it, is to have the ability to bear children. Interesting that they are not arguing that, as they are in France.

“As a lesbian couple, me and my partner can’t just wake up in the morning and say, we’re going to have a baby,” she said. “But without [Medically Assisted Procreation - MAP for short], procreation is near impossible. It would be terribly hypocritical for the Socialists to introduce an ‘equality’ bill without allowing us the same parenting rights as our heterosexual peers. Half-hearted equality is not equality.”

Even then, true equality is not there, as heterosexual couples will still be able to have babies without medical intervention. The only true equality will be when all procreation is medically assisted. If we want to follow the equality argument to it full conclusion, that is.

Then there was the sentimental argument from long time foe, Jordan Carter, who used to be a blogger, and seems now to be working himself towards becoming a Labour MP.

Submitter Jordan Carter asked MPs to consider how they'd feel if they were in the minority rather than homosexuals.

I'm in the minority here in New Zealand as a practicing Catholic and I feel sad for those who aren't Catholic. All those who aren't Catholic are missing out on so much by not having access to the Sacraments and to Our Lord Himself. However, I won't be agitating for a law to pass, making it mandatory for everyone to attend Mass, no matter how good it would be for them, and how much better it might make me feel (though I know it wouldn't be a true conversion, so I wouldn't end up feeling any better about it).

As I've said previously, sentimentalists are not reasonable people, they are ruled by their feelings, and so see nothing wrong in trying to make an emotional argument rather than a logical one. It will get some people, making them feel guilty for making someone else feel different.

So many silly arguments, starting with Louisa Wall herself, so little time to comment.

4. At the outset, much of the opposition has been motivated by a basic premise that some people consider homosexuality is unacceptable or a sin. There have been attempts to revisit issues that have already been determined. In other words some opponents need to be honest and declare that what they truly seek is to repeal the Homosexual Law Reform Act 1986. This is evidenced by the number of vocal opponents who argue from a first principle position of homosexuality being a sin and homosexuals being sinners. It is also evidenced by their pragmatism in changing from a position of opposition to the Civil Union Act 2004 to one of expressing support for that Act in order to oppose this Bill. That position promotes the view that all homosexual New Zealanders are different and should be satisfied with the created institution of Civil Union.

Again, homosexuality is not a sin. Acting on homosexual desires is a sin, just as acting on heterosexual desires that aren't directed at your spouse is a sin. Lustful thoughts are a sin, viewing pornography is a sin, masturbating is a sin, using contraception is a sin. A person can be attracted to those of the same-sex, but never act on those attractions and therefore that person is not sinning. There might be people who are confused as merge the sinner and the sin into one, but that is not the stance of Christians who know their faith well. Louisa Wall is either talking about a small minority of people here, or those she has created in her head to attack. Also, homosexual New Zealanders (those that are attracted to persons of the same sex) are different, otherwise we wouldn't have words to describe them, and otherwise Jordan Carter above wouldn't be trying to get everyone to emotionally connect with him as to how it might feel to be in the minority.

Let's hope and pray that when this abysmal bill actually gets back to Parliament, that our MPs wake up from their feel good, let's change the world frame of mind, and actually think about what they might be doing for the whole of New Zealand, rather than a very vocal, but small lobby group.