Sunday, February 21, 2010

Andrei She really said that?


The yuk factor invoked and a thought crime committed by New Hampshire Representative Nancy Elliott in seeking to repeal New Hampshire's Gay Marriage laws.

26 comment(s):

Redbaiter said...

Check out Ryan Sorba at the CPAC conference for something similar-


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFNezndrSII&feature=player_embedded

leftrightout said...

Well, there's a lot of anti-gay stuff out there, but tnhis one takes the cake.

As a rational human, I condemn his actions.

"An anti-gay clergyman in Uganda has screened gay pornography in his church, in an attempt to gain support for proposed anti-homosexuality laws."

\
I'm not sure if his church is part of something larger, or if he's just a one man band with an internet divinity certificate, but this is sick sick sick..


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8521471.stm

Andrei said...

Me to LRO - here is what the Archibishop of Kampala has to say on this matter.



The Catholic Church in Uganda Against Homosexuality bill |

Written by Dr. Cyrian Kizito Lwanga, Archibishop of Kampala
Wednesday, 23 December 2009
We, the Catholic Bishops of Uganda, appreciate and applaud the Government’s effort to protect the traditional family and its values.
The Catholic Church is clear in its teaching on homosexuality. Church teaching remains that homosexual acts are immoral and are violations of divine and natural law. The Bible says that homosexuality is strictly forbidden (Lev. 18:22) “Do Not lie with a man as one lies with a woman, that is detestable”, Further more the Catechism of the Catholic Church states that “ Homosexual acts are contrary to the natural law, and under no circumstances can they be approved.” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, No. 2357)
However, the Church equally teaches the Christian message of respect, compassion, and sensitivity. The Church has always asked its followers to hate the sin but to love the sinner. Considering the fact that all are called by God to fulfill his Will in their lives and to repent of their sins (Mk1:14-15) “After John had been arrested, Jesus came to Galilee proclaiming the Gospel of God: “This is the time of fulfillment. The Kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.” Homosexuals have the need of conversion and repentance. They also need support, understanding and love as all strive to be members of the Kingdom of God
The recent tabled Anti-Homosexuality Bill does not pass a test of a Christian caring approach to this issue. The targeting of the sinner, not the sin, is the core flaw of the proposed Bill. The introduction of the death penalty and imprisonment for homosexual acts targets people rather than seeking to counsel and to reach out in compassion to those who need conversion, repentance, support and hope. The bible says in Luke 6:36-37 “Be merciful just as your Father is merciful. Do not judge and you will not be judged. Do not condemn and you will not be condemned. Forgive and you will be forgiven.”
Further more, the Proposal to prosecute those who fail to disclose information regarding homosexual acts puts at risk of the breach of confidentiality and professional ethics of persons such as Parents, Priests, Counselors, Teachers, Doctors and Leaders, at a time when they offer support and advise for rehabilitation of homosexuals. The proposed Bill does not contain clauses encouraging homosexuals to be rehabilitated. As a Catholic Church, we have a mission to reach out to all of the people of God as Christ showed no one is beyond God’s mercy and love, “In Mt 9:10-13, while Jesus was at table in his house, many tax Collectors and sinners came and sat with Jesus… The Pharisees saw this and said to his Disciples, Why does your Teacher eat with Tax Collectors and sinners? He heard this and said, Those who are well do not need a Physician, but the sick do. Go and learn the meaning of the words, I desire Mercy not sacrifice, I did not come to call the Righteous, but sinners.”
The criminalizing of such reaching out is at odds with the core values of the Christian faith.
Additionally, in our view the proposed Bill is not necessary considering that acts of sodomy are already condemned under section 145 of the penal code.
+Cyprian. K. Lwanga
ARCHBISHOP OF KAMPALA
23rd December 2009

Psycho Milt said...

Maybe if Rep Elliott experienced sodomy instead of just blathering on about it irrelevantly in committee meetings, she'd be a little less obsessed with it. She should consider it for her fellow committee members' sake.

I.M Fletcher said...

Good for her! About time someone stood up and said, hey this isn't normal or natural — a guy sticking his manhood into what is essentially the sewage pipe of another guy's body. I don't want to discriminate against gays in any way but how is that sex?

It isn't. Two gay people can't have sex (sexual intercourse); they can only stimulate each other to orgasm.

It isn't up to me to condemn anyone and people can do what they like in the privacy of their own homes but once they start changing laws to make it normal and teaching stuff to kids in school like she said, that is where I draw the line.

Ciaron said...

Correct me if I'm wrong....
the purpose of sex is to procreate.
Homosexual sex never achieves procreation, therefore it is not right. (by that, I mean not normal/natural)

Psycho Milt said...

Correct me if I'm wrong....
the purpose of sex is to procreate.


It has been for me on a number of occasions, but honestly stated a tiny minority - in the overwhelming majority of incidents, measures were taken specifically to prevent procreation, not to mention various practices engaged in which were definitely "sex" but for which procreation was a wildly unlikely outcome. I have good reason to believe I'm not unusual in this respect.

About time someone stood up and said, hey this isn't normal or natural — a guy sticking his manhood into what is essentially the sewage pipe of another guy's body.

1. You might want to take into account that both sexes have the same pipe and the male libido isn't particularly fussy - ie, it's not necessarily a gay thing.

2. In what sense is "not normal" a pejorative? Great intelligence, beauty, bravery or sporting prowess is also "not normal." Should we be speaking out against those too?

3. All Elliott (and you) are saying is that you find this sexual practice disgusting so people shouldn't do it.

Well, fair enough - it's a free country and everyone's entitled to their opinion. What's missing is some reason why Rep Elliott should start regaling fellow committee members with her thoughts on anal sex in what's ostensibly a meeting about laws relating to marriage.

leftrightout said...

I agree PM. I have also had a number of sexual episodes that were never intended to contribute to procreation, but were highly pleasurable for all involved, including encounters with more than 2 participants (7 was the biggest group I was in).

Ciaron, I'm pretty sure you're wrong - procreation is only a very small part of the reason for sex, it is also highly pleasurable, without procreation.

As the song from "Hair" goes"

Sodomy, fellatio, cunilingus, pederasty.

Oh mother, why do these words sound so nasty?

Masturbation can be fun, join the holy orgy

Kama Sutra, everyone.

Andrei said...

Funnily enough we are not interested in your sex lives PM and LRO

What is at stake here is what is promoted as normalcy.

And hetrosexual marriage is normalcy and is something to be promoted because of its virtues in raising children.

The focus on "sexuality" over the most important issue of all - child rearing is what our, well my, objection, to "gay marriage".

Ciaron said...

Could you two miss the point any more?

Psycho Milt said...

Funnily enough we are not interested in your sex lives PM and LRO

Hey, at least I'm not doing it while addressing an executive session of the New Hampshire state govt and being paid for it by the state's taxpayers, unlike Ms Elliott.

The focus on "sexuality" over the most important issue of all - child rearing is what our, well my, objection, to "gay marriage".

And you think that Elliott choosing to indulge her obsession with the mechanics of anal sex in an official meeting is in some way helping take the focus off sexuality? It seems to me she's having exactly the opposite effect.

Psycho Milt said...

As expected, the claims were just gossip:

CONCORD – State Rep. Nancy Elliott, R-Merrimack, apologized Tuesday and withdrew her claim that gay sex was being taught to fifth graders in Nashua public schools.

“I would like to apologize to the Judiciary Committee, the Nashua public schools and its employees and the speaker as well as anyone else affected by what I said,’’ Elliott said, reading from a prepared statement at the beginning of a House Judiciary Committee meeting. “I will try much harder in the future to verify fully my statement.”

leftrightout said...

Ciaron said...
Could you two miss the point any more?



Dunno, what IS the point?

A lot of religious people claim that homosexual acts,and hetrosexual anal sex, is "unnatural" and yet they don't see anything unnatural in a celibate priesthood.

THAT is surely unnnatural.

Andrei said...

The point is placing all the emphasis on "sexuality" and virtually none whatsoever on the really important thing that is the raising of the next generation which is insanity.

My goodness my children have been subjected to all sorts of propaganda including endless pap about condoms (a violation of God's law) which are the supposed panacea for STDs and "unwanted pregnancy".

You liberal fools are determined to destroy Western culture with your idolatry of hedonism and drag my kids into hell with you.

I.M Fletcher said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
I.M Fletcher said...

Essentially, I think these changes to law by gays are really to validate their behavior. This civil rights argument is just a smokescreen to help them get what they want.

In the real Civil Rights movement, anyone can see that discriminating against someone because of a physical difference (color - that the person can do nothing about) is wrong.

In the case of gays, they are physically unchangeably heterosexual persons who want their same-sex behaviors legitimized. Why can't pedophiles use the same argument? Or people into bestiality?
It's basically the same argument.

Elle. B said...

What is considered natural and what is not?

People have practised gay sex for many centuries. And even some animals have performed it. What people do behind closed doors is there business not ours. Who are we to discriminated, many have probably thought about it or wanted to try it.

I am not a follower of god although I was when I was young. People of god should accept everyone and not discriminate. Isn't his teachings put in place to make the world better for everyone. Are they not people too.

This world is already over populated and polluted. Having less children would slightly lessen those problems too.

It mentioned the topic was about gay marriage. Is marriage not a union between two people who love each other and want to spend there lives together. In NZ we have the Civil Union. It allows them to be together like in a marriage but without using the lords name.

The lady lady makes me laugh she is so worried about other peoples private practices and the thing they are doing does not affect her in any way or anyone else, there are a lot worse things people do that affect other people everyday.

It is good she apologised.

Psycho Milt said...

The point is placing all the emphasis on "sexuality" and virtually none whatsoever on the really important thing that is the raising of the next generation which is insanity.

Actually, I'm not in a whole lot of disagreement with that. Heterosexual marriage is fundamentally different from gay "marriage" and it's not unreasonable for church and state to want the law to reflect that.

What is unreasonable is Rep. Elliot's and I.M. Fletcher's view that because they find anal sex disgusting, gays must be blocked from anything that might "validate" their behaviour - such as having the state endorse their relationships through some kind of civil union legislation. It is here that the "focus on sexuality" is occurring, more than among the liberals.

Elle. B said...

It has nothing to do with the government what people do behind doors. The government can acknowledge the gay couples as people who want to show there feelings and commitment to each other. Heterosexual couples are not discriminated about the sexual acts they do together.

many heterosexual couples also perform anal sex as well so on that topic homosexual can't be the only ones targeted. It happens a lot more then people may think, just people are too close-minded to accept it and many are too ashamed to say they have done it or even enjoy it because people will call them and their behaviour disgusting.

People do many things sexually that are unnatural for example the dildo and other sex toys. Is sticking something rubber up there natural? Are blow jobs natural as well? Your are sticking something in you mouth, that is wear food goes. Sticking a penis in there is just like sucking on someone else's toe its not natural is trying to replicate sex too.

Lucia Maria said...

This thread is getting really disgusting - pornographic almost.

I'm considering shutting it down if commenters do not restrain themselves.

Please do not be explicit.

KG said...

Now wait for the accusations of "prudishness"
5..4..3..2..

I.M Fletcher said...

What is unreasonable is Rep. Elliot's and I.M. Fletcher's view that because they find anal sex disgusting, gays must be blocked from anything that might "validate" their behaviour - such as having the state endorse their relationships through some kind of civil union legislation.

Milt, it's not just that I find it disgusting - it's also dangerous and dysfunctional. Are you saying that that the state should OK everything? As I read in another article, "A person’s inclination toward a form of sexual conduct may not, for any number of reasons, be consciously chosen, but the mere existence of desire does not justify the act. To accept otherwise would be to validate adultery and pedophilia. Society has the right to require people to suppress harmful desires, even if it is difficult for them to do so. "

If homosexuality is not innate (there is plenty of evidence that homosexuality is not innate), it must be acquired. And if it can be acquired, we dare not allow homosexuality to be legitimized to our children. If there remains any shadow of doubt as to the cause of homosexuality, we must err on the side of protecting our children. Indeed we must actively discourage them from viewing homosexuality as safe and normal, when in fact it is demonstrably neither safe nor normal. It bears noting here that normalcy is functioning according to nature or design. Normalcy is not based on popular opinion.

In summary, the true definition of homosexuality is same-gender sexual conduct. A homosexual is a person who defines himself or herself by the participation in or desire to participate in such conduct.

leftrightout said...

IMF, I am not convinced that defendthefamily.com, abiding truth ministries and Scott Lively are unbiased sources. There is a large body of evidence to show that homosexuality is inate, in Man and in beast.

I.M Fletcher said...

LRO I do not believe that it is innate. I think some people choose the lifestyle, and some people may have had events in their lives (such as abuse by a certain parent, or the influence of only one parent) that pushes them that way.

Some examples that come to mind for me are Michael Glatzee, who was a gay rights leader (a "rising star") in the US and editor of YGA (Young Gay America) magazine. He left the lifestyle and became a Christian, saying that his "coming out" from under homosexuality was one of the most beautiful things that ever happened. In part, he says -


It became clear to me, as I really thought about it – and really prayed about it – that homosexuality prevents us from finding our true self within. We cannot see the truth when we're blinded by homosexuality.

We believe, under the influence of homosexuality, that lust is not just acceptable, but a virtue. But there is no homosexual "desire" that is apart from lust.

In my experience, "coming out" from under the influence of the homosexual mindset was the most liberating, beautiful and astonishing thing I've ever experienced in my entire life.

Lust takes us out of our bodies, "attaching" our psyche onto someone else's physical form. That's why homosexual sex – and all other lust-based sex – is never satisfactory: It's a neurotic process rather than a natural, normal one. Normal is normal – and has been called normal for a reason.

Abnormal means "that which hurts us, hurts normal." Homosexuality takes us out of our normal state, of being perfectly united in all things, and divides us, causing us to forever pine for an outside physical object that we can never possess. Homosexual people – like all people – yearn for the mythical true love, which does actually exist. The problem with homosexuality is that true love only comes when we have nothing preventing us from letting it shine forth from within. We cannot fully be ourselves when our minds are trapped in a cycle and group-mentality of sanctioned, protected and celebrated lust.

Homosexuality took almost 16 years of my life and compromised them with one lie or another, perpetuated through national media targeted at children. In European countries, homosexuality is considered so normal that grade-school children are being provided "gay" children's books as required reading in public schools.

As a leader in the "gay rights" movement, I was given the opportunity to address the public many times. If I could take back some of the things I said, I would. Now I know that homosexuality is lust and pornography wrapped into one. I'll never let anybody try to convince me otherwise, no matter how slick their tongues or how sad their story. I have seen it. I know the truth.

God gave us truth for a reason. It exists so we could be ourselves. It exists so we could share that perfect self with the world, to make the perfect world. These are not fanciful schemes or strange ideals – these are the Truth.


Another that comes to mind is former lesbian magazine publisher Charlene Cothran who stunned the homosexual community when she announced she had become a Christian. Her magazine Venus, now caters to those wanting to leave the gay lifestyle. She spent 29 years as a gay activist.

Another guy whose website I have found recently is musician David MacDonald who has left the gay life, become Catholic and married a lovely lady.

His website is useful for answering questions that people may have about Catholic views.

These are only three examples that come to mind, but many people have left the gay lifestyle and found real happiness.

leftrightout said...

IMF, "I don't believe" and "I think" are not proof positive of your argument.

I am sure for every example you can find of a "reformed homosexual" some one will find one of a hetro becoming homo.

I have 3 male friends who have each lost their wife to another woman.

Psycho Milt said...

Are you saying that that the state should OK everything?

I'm saying the state better have a damn good reason for intervening in the sexual activities of consenting adults. Yet to see one in this case.

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